Disputatio Usoris:Evertype

Block

I'm blocking this account because it appears to be operated on behalf of a publisher, so with a possible commercial interest. I noticed the issue because this account removed a link to a text of Alice in Latin; when I check the English pages I find that "Evertype" publishes several translations of Alice. This appears to be getting rather close to a conflict of interest.

I haven't yet restored the link to the Latin translation: I don't know whether that site is breaching Carruthers' copyright or has permission to do what it does. Further information on that point, and other comments, welcome! Andrew Dalby (disputatio) 11:45, 23 Augusti 2011 (UTC)

You're blocking my account? I am en:Michael Everson, yes. I am also en:User:Evertype. This is no secret. Are publishers not permitted to use the Wikipedia? I protest vehemently at my account being blocked without discussion or warning, Andrew. Evertype 11:58, 23 Augusti 2011 (UTC)

I am a publisher, yes. I am also preparing a new, authorized edition of this book for publication this year. I know the Estate personally. Clive Harcourt Carruthers' 82-year-old son Graham and his wife in Westport, Co. Mayo, on 2010-05-22. They gave me their permission and blessing to re-publish the book. In 1994 Macmillan published an reprint of Alicia in Terra Mirabili and on its copyright page wrote ""The publishers have been unable to trace the executors of the Estate of the Late Professor Carruthers. We should be grateful if they would get in touch with us at the above address." The website which contains an incomplete version of the text of Carruthers' book does not give any indication that the copyright belongs to the Carruthers Estate, and indeed claims copyright on the text itself. I have also written to that website to point out that they do not have permission to illegally publish the text of Alicia in Terra Mirabili. Now I think that your blocking my account without discussion for the grounds you gave is an abuse of Administrator rights, in the first place, as is your accusation that I removed the link in order to sell my own books. Surely the burden of proof is on you to demonstrate that the incomplete copy of the text on that website is authorized, before restoring the link and (in evident bad-faith) blocking me from editing here? Evertype 12:03, 23 Augusti 2011 (UTC)

Is there a rule on the Latin Wikipedia that the appearance of "conflict of interest" is grounds for immediate blocking without discussion? Is there no room for good faith over here? Do you think that I am interested in my own profit rather than in the rights of the Carruthers Estate? Evertype 12:09, 23 Augusti 2011 (UTC)

Andrew can speak for himself, but a temporary blocking when locally unknown potentially competing commercial interests pop up is often an appropriate precaution. Your edit seems reasonable to me, in view of the explanation given above; however, the word illegal in the edit box is a red flag: copyright law can lead in unexpected directions, and what's legal and not legal isn't always obvious or indisputable. Experience with my own copyright suggests that whether the author's estate has the right to authorize the commercial publishing of a reprint probably depends on the terms of the contract between the author and the press, not on the mere fact of holding the copyright. (What's the news from Macmillan?) Good luck! IacobusAmor 12:53, 23 Augusti 2011 (UTC)

OK, Michael, thanks for your reply. As I said, I haven't restored that link; I was waiting for clearer information.

I noted that your only other edit here has been to add a link to an Evertype website. I can't see any abuse or bad faith in what I've written above and on your English user talk page. Of course, if you want to complain of me, write to any other magistratus -- indeed, I'll unblock you right now, which should make it easier! Andrew Dalby (disputatio) 12:17, 23 Augusti 2011 (UTC)

Well I am surprised that a block would have been applied before discussing it with the potential blockee. Now I have a block on my record. Evertype 12:41, 23 Augusti 2011 (UTC)

The other edit I made, does link to a page on my website. It links to a free set of lessons in Volapük. I hardly see that as a conflict of interest. Evertype 12:45, 23 Augusti 2011 (UTC)

I just spoke with Macmillan, who, interestingly, have found the Carruthers Estate now, and in fact a republishing a new edition of the Latin Alice this month. I had a lively chat with a woman there and told her the story of my own meeting with the Estate, and plans to publish my own edition, probably next month. The two editions will differ in a number of ways. In due course I will probably post bibliographical information about both of them to the Alice page on this wiki. I hope you will not consider it inappropriate. Evertype 12:45, 23 Augusti 2011 (UTC)

Increased availability of the text will undoubtedly be welcome! IacobusAmor 12:57, 23 Augusti 2011 (UTC)

I noticed the "evertype" in the previous link you added: I came to it fresh from looking through the links to Alice translations you publish, and I guess that's why I didn't check whether that volapük link was commercial or not. So I'm sorry you have a block on your record, Michael. I currently don't, but who knows how long that will last :)

Yes, I think we do block more quickly than they do on en:wiki. This is partly because there are fewer of us, and there are many users who just drop in here momentarily: they might not notice warnings, they do notice blocks. On the bright side, we are equally quick and informal about unblocking.

I'm really sorry that what you thought would be a single new edition of the Latin Alice turns out to have competition. Very unfair. Of course, bibliographical information is always good and always wanted, even from publishers, and especially from publishers who know about bibliography. Andrew Dalby (disputatio) 13:08, 23 Augusti 2011 (UTC)

Actually the two books will be quite different. The 2011 Macmillan edition will have a preface by... somebody whose name I didn't catch. The 2011 Evertype edition has been edited to take into account contemporary reviews of errors in the book, marks long vowels, distinguishes i/j, and includes a number of appendices of other translator's versions of some of the poems in the book, and some essays. Evertype 13:12, 23 Augusti 2011 (UTC)